Celebrity Interview | Entertainment & Film Industry: Alfred Hsing on Train Dreams, Martial Arts, Acting, and Representation

Greg Staffa 0:00

You're listening to the Staffa Corner Podcast, a Staffa carriage look at entertainment of life with your host, Greg Staffa. My guest this episode is talented actor. He's an actor, stuntman, and stunt coordinator. Born in San Jose, California, he is the first American to win a gold medal in the World Wu Shoe Championship. He currently is starring in the film Train Dreams, but also can be seen in films like Ready Player One, Joel Zake Silicon Valley, NCIS LA, CIS New York, and my personal favorite, the Book of Bob Effect. Alfred, thank you for coming on today.

Alfred Hsing 0:57

Thank you for having me.

Greg Staffa 0:59

So tell us a little bit about your your childhood. Your Taiwanese descent.

Growing Up Bilingual And Finding Wushu

Greg Staffa 1:03

You're born in San Jose, California. What was that like growing up as a child?

Alfred Hsing 1:08

Correct. I'm from the Bay Area. My my parents grew up in Taipei, and my grandparents grew up in Tundu and Shanghai. So yeah, I was I was born in a kind of a bilingual family in the Bay Area. I went to school out there, and very at a very young age, you know, I I was um exposed to Jackie Chan and Jet Lee films. So I think that kind of got ingrained in me, and I subconsciously wanted to, you know, get into martial arts. And so at the time there wasn't as much, you know, variety of martial arts as there is today. And we had kind of the the early stages of Chinese martial arts coming to America, like uh in the sport that I do, wushu. So I went to one of the one of the first schools out there in the Bay Area, and that's kind of how I got into martial arts. I was, you know, at the same time, of course, going to school out there, and also how I kind of got as growing up as an Asian American, how I got a little bit more in tune with, you know, the the culture, uh, martial arts and the culture uh and the Chinese culture as well.

Greg Staffa 2:12

Your parents, I assume, were from Taiwan, but you growing up in San Jose, was there an effort on your part or your family's part to kind of keep that culture along with your American culture? Or how was how did that play into things? Was that something that you really wanted or strive for, or was that something that was important to your family?

Alfred Hsing 2:33

You know, when I was young, I didn't really think much of it. You know, um California, especially the Bay Area, has a you know decent Asian population. But but uh but of course, you know, like yeah, we still there was still we faced differences and and you know, obviously certain cultural differences. But I I grew up in the household. My parents naturally spoke Chinese and going to school, I spoke English. So and then and then they would make um I mean sometimes they would make Western dishes and sometimes they'd make Chinese dishes. So I would I'd be bringing uh like some Chinese food to school sometimes. But uh, you know, fortunately for me, I had kind of a diverse group of friends, um, of all, you know, kind of backgrounds. Some were Asian, some were not. And so I grew up in a you know in an environment that I felt like there was some good diversity.

Greg Staffa 3:24

What got you involved

Culture, Identity, And School Days

Greg Staffa 3:25

into acting then?

Alfred Hsing 3:26

Yeah, so I think it all it really all goes back to, you know, my my dad was bringing home some videos of like uh my dad was bringing home some Jackie Chan films basically. And, you know, that's what I would say is, you know, during you know, during the earlier times of of American cinema, I guess, like there was a lot less Asian representation in in Hollywood or in mainstream media. So, you know, my exposure to what would be considered like a superhero or someone that was heroic and and doing larger than life things, saving people, helping people, my exposure to that was through, you know, Jackie Chan and Jet Lee. And of course, Jackie Chan had a Western sensibility as well since he came up in Hong Kong. And so I looked, I looked up to those films. I thought what they were what they were doing was was really exciting, really cool. And it to kind of tie back to the answer, um, I had a love for martial arts, but I also had a love for performance, being on screen, you know, performing in the in the acting sense, because what Jackie Chan was doing in his

From Jackie Chan Fan To Performer

Alfred Hsing 4:32

films was both acting as an on-screen performer and of course doing you know action stunts, martial arts. So I just I just think I had such he was such an inspiration for me when I was young that I I wanted to you know get close to what he was doing. And so I have always enjoyed um acting as well. So when I was in elementary school, you know, I was in part of the school play. In high school, I was in the drama club, and in college I took all of the theater classes for non-majors. Um I went to UCLA, I studied economics, but I took all of the you know theater classes possible, and I also took classes on the side, and then ultimately, even later on, I got a degree at the Beijing Film Academy in acting and performance. So I think I've always just had an inclination to it, not trying to make a career out of it, but I just I just liked acting, performing on stage. I thought it was fun, and then I combined that with physical movement, uh, just my own love of martial arts and and uh you know movement of the body.

Greg Staffa 5:32

One of the things that I've always found surprising is a lot of actors, upon reflection, uh will talk about how their childhood had a lot to do with them becoming an actor because it allowed them to escape. Uh, maybe they were shy, maybe they were timid, maybe they didn't feel like they fit in, and acting was a way for them to almost become someone else. Growing up, you know, in America, but having that Taiwanese descent, was that a part of it? I don't mean to put words in your mouth, but was that part of it that even though there was a lot of your culture surrounding that area, was some of it an escape to to be other things, not to denounce your Taiwanese ship, but I mean to to be someone else.

Alfred Hsing 6:20

Hmm. Let me think. Let me let me think on that. I um I I think that I think I've I think so I'm I'm the uh I'm the oldest of two siblings, so I'm kind of the you know, I'm I'm I'm the oldest son. And um I think I I always did enjoy um well it's I think I don't know if it was more of a adaptation, but uh my my parents um my parents pushed me to to kind of always uh be my best, you know, of course do well in school and and kind of like you know what what's known kind of you know like Asian parents or what whatnot, there's kind of a a saying of that that they're they you know they want their children to you know succeed and do well. And so I I think I I felt those those pressures, but also at the same time, um, like I said, maybe it's adaptation, but that became part of my identity to um always

Why Acting Felt Like Home

Alfred Hsing 7:20

like you know try to do my best and to oh yeah, there's a there's a desire for me to um yeah do my best, excel, um and and and and all that. And so I think performance was part of that. You know, I I was in speech class. I I had you know, even I went to like an extracurricular Chinese school on the weekends and and I I did um kind of like speech competitions in in Mandarin and I think I always liked I think I just liked performing and and and sometimes I it was there were nerves, you know, I was kind of like nervous, but I I think I liked that feeling of uncomfortability and pushing myself. So I think that's where you know that kind of came from. But I do think you're still correct that I don't know, maybe deep down I it's something I need to explore further, but I don't know that I was necessarily escaping in terms of uh you know being someone of of dual cultures and identities, but rather I I did enjoy, you know, playing other, you know, playing other characters because when you have the hardships of your own your own personal life and like of try you know trying to do well in school, try to uh be an upstanding, you know, like just try to be almost you know, try to be perfect, uh uh essentially when you when you feel that when you play another character, that's not you. So you can be sloppy, you can, you know, have you can you can explore or reveal imperfections, you can um you know be a completely different life, or you can even be, you know, find aspects of truth in your own life that maybe you're you're you're not comfortable showing people because because it makes you emotionally you know vulnerable. So at the same time, doing acting, it helps you get in touch with your emotions and and become more vulnerable, but at the same time, you are uh

Pressure, Perfection, And Vulnerability

Alfred Hsing 9:22

you have this layer of playing a character, so in in a way, you are not necessarily judged for you revealing some certain you know vulnerability about yourself, but rather the vulnerability that's connected to you, but that's exhibited through another character. So I know that that was a great question. That was kind of deep.

Greg Staffa 9:41

No, that makes sense. And I I wasn't trying to infer that you were d denouncing you know your heritage. I just meant that sometimes it's not always easy growing up in a neighborhood where not everyone looks like you, and so as a way to kind of get out of your own reality, sometimes it's nice to have that escape. So what I wasn't trying to that you were ashamed or you know, trying to denounce anything.

Alfred Hsing 10:04

Yeah, like like I said, I think that just the my my my biggest thing I would say on that is just that I I may have been uh you know, as a child been oblivious to it and just just you know went through life without kind of the the consciousness of certain things, but um just you know relevant to today, I would say that there was there was not as many figures or mainstream media figures to look up to that I could fully culturally relate to or that that you know looked like me. And you know, that's part of why I feel I love what I do, but I also do feel that that's part of contributing and playing a role as a somewhat of a you know role model or inspiration or whatever it can be. But being myself and also being able to play a character on screen that is like of Chinese descent or Asian descent, and that other people growing up can have more references and more uh people that look like themselves in media so that they can relate to or that they can be inspired by or connect with, you know. So I think that is important.

Greg Staffa 11:12

Is that an unfair burden that's put on you? As welcoming as it make it sound, you know, Tom Hanks doesn't have to kind of defend his heritage or you know, worry about how he looks when he he's doing something. Is that an unfair burden that we place? I mean, you're most jobs, you know, you're there to do a job, you're an actor, you're not necessarily have to be a role model, but yet we place those things on you, or you place themselves on yourself. Is that an unfair thing that we do, or is that just part of life? Hmm.

Alfred Hsing 11:46

I mean, I think that in my opinion, if someone is in the you know, entertainment or acting or arts profession and they are fulfilling their job as uh you know, playing a character, then that I think, you know, that's fine. You know, they're if they're they're they're doing their job, not harming others, you know, just just just doing their thing, at least on face, I think I think that's um you know, it is what it is. I think that it's um it's a choice if someone like it's a choice if someone realizes that they can make an impact, that they are

Representation And Responsibility

Alfred Hsing 12:25

in a position or a platform where they might be recognized or or or seen, and they have the option to, you know, kind of steer things in a in a positive manner, I think that's a choice. And for me, it's you know, I'm mo I'm motivated by it, not solely by it, but for for me, I think, you know, if I can do what I love, which is performing, you know, interacting, connecting, and doing, you know, martial arts plus you know, storytelling, if I can do all those things and also um have some positive contribution, then I'm I'm all for it. You know, I I think some roles, maybe I you just have to dive in there and just focus on your role and and the sole job of you know doing a good job, whether you're playing, you know, a villain or what whatever it is, but you're playing a role and you're doing a good job and you have you have some recognition from that, I think I think that's still that's still good work, you know, because people are seeing that you're you're you're motivating in the sense that you're performing well, you're doing your, you know, like I think like in part you do as a as who I am, being in the Asian community, you you by default kind of represent in some ways, especially when it's a a smaller community or at least like a more up and coming in terms of its length of history in you know western uh cinema. So so automatically the people that are in the forefront are going to have some kind of you know recognition or or people are gonna refer to them whether they're good or bad, you know. So I think you just have to recognize that. But but yeah, for me ultimately, I feel like if I can, I'd rather, you know, try to make a positive difference than be a like a negative role model, you know, and not not that any I'm saying anyone's life is perfect, you know, but but at least being cognizant of that, you know.

Greg Staffa 14:19

So would you consider yourself an actor who does stunts or a stunt man who does acting?

Alfred Hsing 14:25

Okay. I mean, good question. Good question, and I I'm aware of how I think the mind works. You know, we we wanna s yeah, we kind of want to see that. But and I'm I'm half joking here, but I I kind of hate that there is this uh you know kind of distinct dichotomy, you know. No, because I I feel like people, regardless of their career, are multifaceted, you know. You're you're not just a a son or a um you know a host or a cook or whatever, you know, we're we're all these things. We're we could be a son, a brother, um, a father, you know, and and likewise I feel like I'm someone that likes performing. I I hope and I think I'm capable of you know acting or performing. And I also happen to have a deep history with martial arts and and and movement. So that's just part of who I am. So I don't know if I would say I'm one or the other, but to give a less vague answer, right now I would I would love to be in parts or roles where I can contribute, you know, in my in my acting, in in kind of how in my choices and how I think, but also use physicality in any way, whether it's an action movie, which is you know, right up my alley, or if it's if it's just in understanding your body and and doing something that's more dramatic or more comedic. So I would I I love both, you know, and I I don't ever want to necessarily separate or ostracize one or the other and say, um, yeah, no, I'm I'm just focusing on acting

Actor, Stunt Performer, Or Both

Alfred Hsing 16:05

now and and uh stunts is you know different, uh it's separate for me. I embrace going on, I I love doing cool, cool, fun stunts or action scenes, but I have a deeper history with stunts, so I would love to explore further performance and just I I love the creative choices and and developing characters in the story, and I would love to do more of that.

Greg Staffa 16:28

To push your somewhat vague answer a little bit more. Yes if you're you know if your people came to you and said, We have a role for this film, two films, we got two offers for ya. One is an action star in this movie, and you're the lead role in it. The other is a romantic comedy that you'd be the lead in. What goes into your decisions in deciding one or the other to choose from? How do you, when you're getting scripts, what yeah, what factors play into getting roles? Are you looking for that action element or are you looking for you know a quality role? What goes into it?

Alfred Hsing 17:07

Right, right. You know, if if I and hey, anyone out there, you know, if you got these projects, let me know. I would I would love to do both, and I think the decision factor between a leading action movie role versus a um you know a romantic or romantic comedy film, all ultimately for me, if if those two projects were on the table on the exact same day, it would depend on the script, you know, aka aka the story, and also the team. So which project is gonna come together better? Which project is going to move people more? And it doesn't have to be moving someone in terms of sobbing, but move them like they they get excited, you know, it it they feel heightened. You know, is it a is it an action thriller? Is it kind of a you know, really over the top sci-fi action, but but you still get very hyped and you you really enjoy it and and it's a it's a it's a kick-ass film, and and you know, you just yeah, you you just get really excited watching it, or or you know, is it also like um are we are we changing the game with action? You know, is it a film that that when you watch it, you're like, wow, like, you know, we're we're we're making a statement, you know, like there's there are action films out there, but we just watched one that really was, you know, it pushed the limits, whether on physical or on on camera work, on choreography. Like, that's all exciting to me. On the contrary, you know, a romantic comedy, it's really warm, it's really funny, it really pulls at the the right, you know, chords, and I have great chemistry with with the other actors on it. And the director is great with comedy. Um, uh I I love Ben Stiller. I'm I don't know if he does any action comedy, I mean uh God, romantic comedies, but like um, anyways, like if they have a good mind for comedy or for um that romantic element that that's gonna be a nice little warm

Choosing Roles And Reading Scripts

Alfred Hsing 19:06

Christmas holiday film or something, and and I can tell that it's written well or told well and with a very um open-minded uh director that that that's kind of open to like collaborative thought or or just you know letting the best ideas make it into the film, that would be awesome for me too. So so both of those would be would be great.

Greg Staffa 19:28

I I recently had uh kind of an epiphany and I I changed my opinion slightly on this, and I don't mean to put you totally on the spot. If you want to give a vague cop out answer, I completely understand. It makes it honest here, but you have a long history of working with like Jackie Chan's stunt team, which is world renowned. Uh you have done uh work with Jet Lee, so your training you won the gold medal in the World Who Shoe Championships. So your stunt training. Is at a level that is almost uncomparable to anyone else almost in acting. What are your thoughts? And again, you can be completely vague, when actors like Tom Cruise now are doing more and more stunts, they look amazing, and I'll I'll share my answer first just to kind of give you some cover. Um I am totally thrilled and amazed and awed with the stuff that Tom Cruise does. I think it's amazing. But I was watching reactions to the latest Mission of Possible film, and the people were screaming, Oh my god, Tom, Tom, holy cow, Tom! And I realized that his stunts brought the audience out of the film. We weren't watching the film anymore. We were watching the amazing thing that Tom was doing. Highly commendable, highly, you know, wow. But his stunts got so extreme that it drew the audience out, and we were praising Tom, not going, wow, what a great action sequence. Okay. What is your thoughts on actors doing their own stunts? Now, let's ignore your background is you know hugely trained, professional. But when actors kind of take on that stunt role and say, I want to try doing this stunt, what is your feeling on that?

Alfred Hsing 21:21

Okay, okay. Um I okay, I'm I'm gonna try to I'm gonna try to go deep into this um and and to to to prove

Should Actors Do Their Own Stunts

Alfred Hsing 21:29

to you that I'm I'm willing to say like you know bold things. I think that first, even before we go there, thank you for kind of like that that background on myself. And I think that the biggest thing, even even before that all happens, is when someone when someone purely focuses, like is comes from an acting background and doesn't have there there's levels, right? There's levels of experience on set, um, you know, physical experience, you know, whether you're gold medalist in gymnastics or or uh you know a combat, you know, a professional fighter, or there's different levels, right? So I think like oftentimes a lot of actors will completely claim that they have this extensive background in in uh stunt work or they say they do stunt work. And I think those some sometimes I don't blame them because it's you don't know what you don't know, but I do think that uh people should be cognizant when they are the face of it, they're they're they're in the limelight of you know what what what truly is your experience with stunt work when you when you claim you did stunts and the whole film and and all this, and um or that you claim you you uh have extensive experience um with on-screen combat, like do you, or to what level do you? And and sometimes it like I said, it's a matter of you don't know what you don't know, but thing is a lot of people all people will claim that they have like such a high level, and you know, before you're brought onto the project, maybe casting or maybe the director or producers don't know to what extent, but everyone is saying that they're all at a certain level. So I I think people should at least uh be aware of like how much does go into the you know the effort, the training, and the the professionalism of stunt professionals. So that's one thing I I I kind of thought of as you said that. But with the I think I I've never worked with um with with Tom Cruise. I I know some people that have, and I know you know a lot of people in the stunt industry, I would say he's an anomaly because they say that he, I mean, he is as trained as as like high-level stunt people, and obviously depending on what the specific area of stunts are, but in terms of um car work, motorcycles, you know, like that that big gag that he did. I mean, he he does that stuff. So so I I feel like in the rare group of people, you know, Jackie Chan, of course, being one, uh, Tom Cruise, they're pushing themselves beyond, you know, simply acting and then going in for, you know, two weeks of training and then doing a stunt or two. They're they're really putting in an another level of commitment that does bring them to a um higher level of of skill, you know. But yeah, I think I think that when people you go to the movie theater for for you know for for some either escapism or or excitement or to feel something. And even if we pop, even if we kind of pop out of the movie because we're like, oh wow, it's Tom Cruise, but if it does give audiences uh like a a wow factor or a reason to go into the theater knowing that a real human being did a certain risk, or even if there's still safety nets or certain certain things there, but like they push their physical limitation truly and they put in effort and and true dedication, I think that's to be commended, especially in a time where you know we're we're easily being flooded and overflooded by you know AI and even like certain like levels of CGI and stuff that that that takes us away from the realism of things, and it kind of cheapens any really difficult, you know, like some double backflip or a very difficult move because it if you can just create that with a prompt, people start to get numbed by that. And and when someone does work very hard, maybe 10 years, to do a really, really complex, you know, like skateboard trick or or martial arts one one-take sequence, you know, it it kind of cheapens it. And at the same time, it also shows us how valuable that is in this day and age when people really put in the work and that physical grind in order to give you something like that on screen.

Greg Staffa 25:56

Okay, you've somewhat won me back. And it wasn't a it wasn't

Spectacle, Story, And Believability

Greg Staffa 26:00

a uh you know, a slight at Tom or anything of the amazing work he's done. It's just I realized watching other people's reaction to his film, because they have like the reactions on on YouTube now that you can watch.

Alfred Hsing 26:11

Yeah.

Greg Staffa 26:12

And I was just surprised at how many people were taking out of out of the film to wa watching him, and I started wondering if that was becoming more of a detriment than anything. So it wasn't wasn't a slight Tom is just uh curious to your own.

Alfred Hsing 26:26

Well, you know, you know my thought on that is also like I feel like if a movie uh presents itself well, so I feel like when when people have the right expectations, that's also an important thing for a film. You know, if if it's a award season film that's quiet and powerful and you you go in with this mindset, versus hey, it's you know, it's Saturday with friends and you want to see a cool action flick, you know. So so I feel like certain movies, like like especially the Mission Impossible uh franchise, is kind of built around Tom doing cool things, you know, like what and even even um Jackie Chan um once said, I mean, I I've worked with him in person, obviously, but but I think he said this on an interview uh is that you know, some of his films he he designs the stunts first, or at least like cool things that he would want to do, you know, jump on a hoverboard or uh or hovercraft or or climb down this thing, and then they kind of make the movie around that. So you're you're kind of going into the movie, like I said, seeing that and seeing that they that these real people did did these real things. Whereas, so I feel like that's fine because you're you know what it is, but if it's a movie that you're supposed to be really um engaged with the story, and then you know, and then someone someone does something that makes it too like, oh, that's takes you out of that character and brings you more to the reality of oh, that's Tom Cruise doing this, or that's so-and-so doing this, then then that hurts the story. Like, oh like I have a side story. I was um working for Jet Lee, and we went to visit Aangley on the set of Life of Pi, and randomly, who plays the first Spider-Man?

Greg Staffa 28:06

Toby Maguire. Oh, yeah, yeah.

Alfred Hsing 28:08

I'm sorry, yeah. Yeah, randomly, Toby Maguire was on set. We were it was kind of like towards the end of the production that they were like almost done. And apparently he was supposed to be that like this journalist or this interviewer that goes and kind of is like, you know, like leads in, you know, this the story, the life of Pi's story. So we'd be cutting out to him and then cutting back into the to the main story with like the the tiger and you know and the boy. But ultimately, um they realized that when people when people watched it, even you know, regardless of if his good acting was good or if he was in character and whatnot, people saw that and they saw Spider-Man in in a Life of Pi movie, you know. So that's where he was taking people out. So I think um I think I heard that ultimately he wasn't put into the film because not because of any other reason, from my understanding, but simply that he was taking people out of the story. So in that case, you know, same thing. If if it was a story like a Life of Pi, and then you had Tom doing the Tom Cruise run and just kind of taking it out, that's it wouldn't be appropriate. But for like an action flick where Tom

Why Stunts Deserve Major Awards

Alfred Hsing 29:16

is doing Tom things, I think it makes more sense.

Greg Staffa 29:20

Alright, you've completely won me over. Um I think I think your analogy is perfect. It's like a dumb comedy, like the Adam Sandler comedies of the you know many years ago. You don't go over there expecting Oscar-worthy performances, you expect dumbed down silliness. And I think your your comment of you know, your perception of what you're going to see, when you're going to see a Mr. Impossible movie, you want to see Tom Cruise do crazy stuff. And so you you won me over from the taking the character out of it and and replacing it with Tom. One quick question on stunts, why is it taking so long for the Oscars to honor stuntman? I mean, you go back to Buster Keaton and you know, early days of Hollywoods, there were stunts. Why is it taking so long to to honor these people?

Alfred Hsing 30:08

Well, yeah, as I mean, as far as I can tell, you know, the directors of of John Wick and and um that that team has probably played a a large part since since they're directing and producing more films and have such a long history of stunt stunt experience in America as well. And so I think they've they along with many others have championed, you know, getting recognition for stunts. You know, I'm I I'm I've definitely been in the stunt industry for for like uh over a decade now, so but I can't say I go as far back as kind of like that Western cowboy, you know, era. But my my take on it is that it's the culture that was cultivated at that time and that has changed over time, you know, in in terms of uh times of change, social media, we have a lot of other things. But you know, back then I think it was important to be like a very modest, silent, you know, like modest, like strong stunt man that you know, you you're you're happy you're proud of your work, but you're in the shadows, and you're not trying to outsine uh the stars. And you know, back then in in like the newer, the earlier era, film was like this super magical thing, you know, not not many people had access. Like we you needed actual film, film, which was expensive, the equipment was big, there was this mystique around the film world and and and movies, you know, uh celebrities were more removed from people, like you, you you couldn't be in their in, you know, like they were inaccessible and whatnot. And so that magic of a stunt double or or stunt people was kind of uh a culture and it was something cultivated in the sun industry. If you wanted to be part of it, you weren't bragging or or you know, at least at least openly saying, Oh yeah, you know, I'm I'm that guy wouldn't be able to do this this horse gag without me. And I mean you it was respectful both both ways, you know, and you also kind of protected your actors that that you doubled because you probably develop a relationship or a bond with them, and and they get you work in the sense that you're doubling them and working alongside them. And I think that that was just embedded, but now with times changing, we have YouTube, we have behind the scenes, you know, more and more people are shooting with their own, you know, digital cameras, and they they recognize that you know, stunts, stunt coordinators, action directors are a huge part of you know putting together the movement and the and and the safety on screen. So I think that people are widely aware of it, but for it to make its impact and and finally reach that top pillar of of recognition, um, it it took some convincing or it took repetitive, you know, like you gotta you gotta keep like reminding and reminding them. And uh so I I think sometimes change is slow, which which is not always a good thing. I mean, I'm glad we we kind of got there, but it's not a good thing in terms of like keeping up with technology and and uh and and and trying to make sure regulations or or

Safety, One‑Upmanship, And Standards

Alfred Hsing 33:28

protocols or just mindset catch up with like fast changing, you know, technology or or you know, just the times.

Greg Staffa 33:38

Is there and this might be above your pay grade, but is there any worry about now having it being a major award, the risk that it might create? Like the cannonball run challenge is a race across the US that people would do and how fast can you get from like Vegas to to you know New York or whatnot, or California, New York? But people started getting reckless, they started going, you know, way too fast or modifying their vehicles to hold too much gas and stuff like that. So it's no longer recognized as uh uh you know an unsanctioned race. Is there a worry in Hollywood that every year or you're I mean, when Tom Hanks gives an Oscar-worthy performance, there's no risk. But when you have a stunt winning, you know, stunt of an Oscar, the next year you have to top it. Is there a risk that that's gonna drive more and more in a few years from now where we're getting despite all the safety measures and stuff like that, we're pushing things in order to get that award, or is that just you're more focused on safety and working with the team?

Alfred Hsing 34:48

Well, I mean, the stunt industry already has their own, you know, awards. There's like the Taurus Awards, there's there's other, you know, forms of recognition. So I I think when a suitable project comes in the way, in the hands of a stunt coordinator that that that still has that drive, people are always gonna want to push it. I mean, you see that with everything, the technology with with with whatever. So even with stunts, I think regardless of uh, you know, a big mainstream award, people are gonna want to one up and and push it, especially stunt people who have such a you know that that fire to do amazing stuff and and push themselves, like challenge themselves and push themselves. So I I think that's gonna exist. You know, of course, safety comes first, and I I think you know, I think the good stunt coordinators are the people that do genuinely value safety first because you know, at the end of the day, we're creating entertainment, and I don't think it's worth it for anyone to you know severely injure or like lose their life for something that's meant to be enjoyable and entertaining. But that being said, a good stunt coordinator is still gonna focus on safety first, but when there is that right project, meaning like the the type of project it is, and the the pr producing team also supports it being a high-level you know action piece, then people are gonna want to push and and do breakthrough things. That's just gonna be natural. And I I think actually having a high-level award and more eyeballs on it might might hopefully you know just create more standards and more safety and and more, you know, like because if if you're in the limelight and people get hurt, you're I think that will equally be observed, you know, and that that could equally also be negative to your um to you know to your reputation. So it's like you gotta keep people safe and do things right, and then hopefully with the right project, push the bar and do do something that's exciting.

Train Dreams And A Career Converging

Greg Staffa 36:58

Now, speaking of well, award season and everything like that, currently have a film, Train Dreams, which is getting a lot of buzz. Tell us a little bit about what you brought you to that, a little bit about the film.

Alfred Hsing 37:10

Yeah, you know, I think Train Dreams to me is like a convergence of of where I'm at right now and and even kind of uh going full circle to your earlier question, you know, how I was doing theater uh at a young age, but also had a love for martial arts. Well, this project came to me through both um, you know, your your standard acting audition, but I also was I just happened to be stunt coordinating a project called Lurker, and one of the producers on that referred me to uh one of the producers on Train Dreams, and and that was kind of like the same day. So because of my work in stunts, I kind of was referred to Train Dreams, but at the same time I still went through the casting process, the auditions, and went through the director, you know, selection, and it kind of converged that they all you know said yes to to bringing me on board, the the producers, the director, the casting uh team. And yeah, and getting to work on this uh a film that is not you know, not an action film or it or and it being a very actually paced, quiet, powerful, beautiful film that's focused on subtleties, you know, a little bit of the less is more, you know, even uh Joel's performance, he does an amazing performance, and he's not his character doesn't really have excessive lines. He's you know, so much can be told in the eyes and the facial expression and and in whatnot. So yeah, so this film to me is is a convergence of all my experience in the industry that's brought me to this. Um I'm I'm proud to be part of something that's kind of uh getting awards recognition and hoping hoping that I'll continue to be able to do films with great story and uh the ability to act in them as well.

Greg Staffa 39:08

It's getting a lot of buzz, so good luck with that. Now, let's say in getting all this buzz, Steven Spielberg checks it out and he loves it, and he comes to you and says, Yo, I got Steven Spielberg money. Alfred, I want you to find a story that resonates with you, and let's tell it together. Is there a story out there that you would love to have the resources, the backing to be able to tell?

Alfred Hsing 39:34

Well, okay, you know, that's funny because technically I worked with Steven Spielberg for one day because I I did uh I had like one line in Ready Player One. And um uh but Adam Somner, um, his first AD was was kind of on set, and he he was he was kind of like reviewing the takes remotely, but um, but he was essentially directing me. So that's That was a dream to work with him there, but yes, that was a like a super, super, you know, small, small part in it. But um You were one of the people that were playing the game competing against everyone else, right?

Dream Projects And East‑West Storylines

Alfred Hsing 40:12

Yeah, in the U like the kind of the introduction of the world of this VR world, um, they were just explaining how people have avatar, you know, or like you know, they're they have virtual characters of themselves, and then they get zeroed out if they, you know, if their their character dies, and and so my character gets s slashed in the virtual world and he becomes all these coins, and then in the real world, you know, I'm I'm sitting down, but because I'm you know I'm moving around in the VR world, I fall down uh off of uh this chair, and then and I'm speaking Chinese, saying something like like like, oh man, you know, or like it's just more of an exclamation of like like shit, I lost my money, you know, or you're like I can't believe it, you know, something like that. And they were just showing that people all around the world play play this game, you know, from all all all backgrounds. But yeah, what would I do? I mean, if if I had the opportunity to if I had the opportunity to do a movie with with all of that resource, you know, I I feel like I'd want to do something in the uh adventure world. Maybe sci-fi, but but I think what I just off of my instinct, you know, off of your question, I'm a huge fan of Indiana Jones. And then there's also a Jackie Chan film called Armor of God, uh, one and two, where Jackie is kind of an explorer, goes seeking, you know, our uh archaeologists like he kind of like finds like excavates stuff or finds you know certain certain things from the past as well. So that that'd kind of be cool, you know, like a travel, travel adventure, you know, like Tomb Raider seeking a lost civilization, maybe maybe something that could bridge a little bit of my Chinese and Western culture, you know, a little a little bit of I would love to do a film that that has Western and Eastern elements organically involved, you know, not where it feels forced like we're we're trying to put one Asian character in just for the Asian demographic or or for um the Chin, you know, the Chinese market, but where it naturally fits in. And and how do things naturally fit in? Well, you know, in in America, there's a diverse, there's just diversity, like there's Asian Americans, there's people of all backgrounds. So like in their natural kind of setting, having people of you know of different backgrounds being there, but not where it feels, you know, like forced. So that that would be cool too, where where it naturally makes sense that maybe there's some interaction with you know Chinese culture or or trying to find something that's uh ancient, you know, artifact. I don't know. That that sounds like it would be up my alley.

Greg Staffa 42:55

It's like a national treasure with a with like uh Asian spin to it. Maybe, maybe, maybe, maybe something like yeah. Oh, wrapping things up and I appreciate your time. I just have a couple of nerd questions for you.

Working With Jet Li And Jackie Chan

Greg Staffa 43:08

Let's go. Um first off, working with Jet Lee and Jackie Chan. Jet Lee, I think American audiences have a limited, you know, picture of him, but Jackie Chan is, I feel, absolutely beloved, you know, here in America. Just his personality. I mean, any interview that you watch with him, he just feels like the guy that you want to just sit and chat with. Can you sum up, not necessarily in sentences, but maybe even like a few words to describe each of these gentlemen?

Alfred Hsing 43:37

Yin and Yang, they they are the complement to one another in the sense that so I I worked extensively, I would say with both, but I was basically uh an executive assistant to Jet Li, but I also ended up doing some choreography, some doubling, you know, a little bit of just a, you know, it was China, so if you can wear many hats, then you you you wear all the hats. So he was more introverted and you know, of course he he can be sociable and charismatic because he's you know he's jetly and he's uh he's an actor. Um but I think he he had his like private circle that like you know his his like his trusted, you know, you're you're in the circle um for him and and those are people that that he's been with for decades and and and that's like his inner circle. And again, I'm I'm sure Jackie is the same, but Jackie's the opposite, he's very extroverted. When you see him, he's gonna welcome you, he's gonna take care of you, he's gonna have large, he he would always have large group dinners, he likes to be around people, he likes to host. He he's like brought the stunt team together and and like randomly, like oftentimes just like out of his own pocket. You know, it wasn't like a production thing, but he'd be like, Oh yeah, we're gonna we're gonna go all eat all eat dinner. And there's a sudden like tons of crates of wine. Um he goes around the table, like, you know, what what do you want? What do you want? And he he knew I was I was like I was pretty much one of or the only Asian American stunt person on the team at at that at that time. Um I mean I'll probably have a unique experience as as being one of the few or only Asian American stunt people in China because if you know if you were to do stunts, why you would either do them in the US or if you were natively born in China, you'd work in in China. So me going out there was was different. But anyways, he would come up and he like, oh, you like you like shrimp scampi? Like he they say like be careful of meeting your heroes. Um, but meeting him, I was not let down. You know, I I will he is how you he kind of presents himself in the you know these interviews and the behind the scenes. Um and whenever other people come visit the set, he's just as you know excited to show them around and host and and you know and be Jackie Chan. So so I've now nothing but good things to say, and um, and he he always made me feel feel welcome. And um, you know, in in ch in China or in Asia, he kind of has a nickname uh Daga, which is like big bro or like big brother, you know, so it's a form of respect, but also that he it goes both ways, that he kind of treats and acts like a big brother to all of the the younger generation.

Greg Staffa 46:21

There there's an interview that he did with uh Steve Harvey, I believe it was, where Steve Harvey would start a stunt and then after the person would finish it or fail it. And that the interaction that he had with the with Jackie Chan and just listening to him talk about something like that, and always examining the stunt and talking. I mean, it was just it was a side that you don't really see. Yeah, you'll see him in the movies and you see, you know, his you know, some interviews like that, but that conversation he had with Steve Harvey was so just humanizing. And he's like, well, if he you know does this little twist here, then he'll succeed. And and it was just such an amazing side to him that I hadn't really seen yet. I've seen him do the funny

Craft, Comedy, And The Science Of Stunts

Greg Staffa 47:09

stuff and I've seen him do you know his older action movies, but that that interview alone was just is something worth checking out on YouTube if anyone, you know, um has time to go see it. It's just it's a really inspiring thing to see.

Alfred Hsing 47:24

Yeah, no, I wanna I wanna say this about about both those guys, or or even honestly, just like you know, a lot of a lot of uh people have who have like quote unquote made it. It's we see a side of them and and he is funny, charismatic, and he's kind of he knows his identity and his brand. But even if he's a funny guy, even if he's a nice guy, both of those guys, Jackie Changetli, they are very smart people. They know their stuff, they're hardworking, and like real really smart, you know, like not necessarily um just you know in a in a academic way or anything, but you know, he's way more involved than just your average person understands. Like he understands shots, he understands, you know, rhythm of of action, but also rhythm of storytelling. He understands when things land, like the the punchline or the joke, or the you know, even if it's a physical comedy, when it lands, you know. So he's he's he didn't he didn't become one of the you know biggest uh names in the world, like just just because he can do a series of backflips, you know. So he's he's really on top of his stuff and he's always curious and he's always learning. So yeah, very talented beyond just what we see of like the physical side.

Greg Staffa 48:41

And just to go back to that video, the the as funny as it was and as entertaining as he was, the technology the technological like breakdown of someone doing a backflip where he could look at it and study it just had not seen it and go, you know, if he shifts to this, he'll fail. If he you know, if it's this, it was just such such an amazing display of you know, these are guys just doing a backflip. There's there's stuff that goes into all this that we don't kind of think about or we don't it's like well, Jackie Chan, of course he can do a backflip, but the the way he breaks it down was just simply fascinating.

Alfred Hsing 49:20

Oh, you know, oh wait, I want to say one thing too, as like, but in terms of Western interviews, there's another interview that you can see online, and uh probably more than one, but people would introduce him as alright, ladies and gentlemen, our next guest is ho ho ha, and doing these like karate chop hands, Jackie Chan. And then at some point, you know, like early in his career, he got that a lot. But at some point, you know, he came on and of course in a in a gracious and loving way, though, he would say, you know, how come no one in introduces, you know, like alright, ladies and gentlemen, ho ho, Robert, ho, De Niro, you know, and and in his in a comical way, he was saying, like, hey, you know, like, like I'm not a I'm not like a you know, dance,

Respect Beyond The Karate Chop Stereotype

Alfred Hsing 50:08

like do this this karate chop thing for me. Like, I'm I'm uh he's a global, you know, sensation. He's a producer, filmmaker, actor, and martial artist. And to be kind of be um just whittled down to only, you know, like uh, you know, a karate chopping guy, um, I think was an oversimplification, you know. And so after I saw that um I was inspired to kind of create my own online um series called Martial Arts and a Meal, where me being someone with a martial arts background, I interviewed other high-level martial arts celebrities slash you know high-level practitioners, and it was my way of kind of returning that that favor of bringing recognition to martial arts and speaking to them, speaking in a language of respect and understanding of martial arts and and of them as a human. So I just thought that that was um, you know, something that people should should kind of like also see that he and and people are more than you know just one thing.

Greg Staffa 51:15

And I don't think there, I mean, as far as stunts go, I don't think there's a group of people that's more respected in the stunt community. Maybe I'm wrong, but then Jackie Chan's stunt team. I mean, the people that he's assembled are some of the the greatest stunt people. I mean, he surrounded himself. This is this is I mean, there's signs to this, there's you know, it's not just you know guys, you know, oh, if you break your arm, you you know, heal up and try it again. It I mean, there's a lot of work that goes into this. I don't think is fully understanding. And and maybe by having its own Oscar now, maybe that will be uh more brought to light of that these aren't just guys doing, you know, these aren't crazy people doing, you know, they're like the adrenaline rush. It's there's a science to it, and I think the science gets lost and like you said, whittled down. Um, I'm going way over. I appreciate your time. Yeah, I appreciate you. Last nerd question growing up a kid in the US, what was it like working on Boba Fett?

Alfred Hsing 52:18

Oh yeah, come on. I mean, I mean, I could say so much about it. I never in my wildest dreams would expect to be a part of the Star Wars universe. Like, come on, I'm canon. You know, I'm the first pike to take off his mask where where you see in in live action what pikes look like, you know, in in in physical, you know, physical form. I I got these tops trading cards, like that was crazy. But my biggest thing was was honestly, I mean, by the way, I would love to be like a Jedi or doing some like, you know, some other other cool stuff like that. Um hopefully there'll be some opportunities in the future. But um working with John Favreau was also a dream for me. And you know, I'm I'm someone that has these goals and always wanted to work with people that inspired me. And and

Inside The Star Wars Universe

Alfred Hsing 53:06

even if it's for you know only a few days or uh a guest star part, you know, I I loved, you know, just John Favreau's work, um, swingers, chef. I think he's a very grounded guy in terms of like I like I like his vision and and everything. So having him like come up to me, you know, I I was the kind of the pike leader in that scene across from Bova Fett. And um, yeah, he he he I think he was an executive producer on the episode, but he was still giving instruction and directing. And so he directed me and was was giving me some some uh feedback, and it was an amazing experience. And he also gave me this um uh I believe it's called like a challenger coin. And he said, Hey, this is from me to you, me to you, and he handed it to me, and I was I was just like wow, I can't believe you know that this is actually happening right now, and uh something he didn't have to do and it was really meaningful, especially as um, you know, still a newer working actor being on that set, it was very impactful for me. And so um, in short, working with him, being part of the franchise was an incredible experience.

Greg Staffa 54:19

Final question, and again, I appreciate you coming on. Yeah, this is a question I asked to all my guests. My introduction to you basically taken off of various bios that you have. Um, you know, we say Alfred Singh, you know, worked with Jackie Chan, worked with Jet Lee. We we talk about you know, Ready Player One or Train Dreams, stuff like that. We talk about the Wu-Shoe Championship. All this stuff is labeled to things that you you've done. We we associate you with the characters you played, the things that you've done. But when you wake up in the morning and you go into the bathroom and splash a little water on your face, look in the mirror for the first time that morning, who is it that you see?

Alfred Hsing 54:58

I just see someone that is, you know, I just still feel like I'm a kid, you know, just with with more more experience, more um, you know, I'm just I'm just dropping pebbles in the bucket in terms of, you know, like like like how you how do you get a backflip, right? It's just incremental. You you you first you jump, you jump and tuck, you jump and tuck, you jump and arch, or like, you know, rotate, and you know, you might have a spotter, and and so I like I feel like I have more accomplishments, I I have more, you know, hopefully more wisdom, um, more more like martial arts skills in the in the you know, in the bag, um, and whatnot, and and even even um accumulation of more material things, but I just feel like I'm still this same kid that has lofty goals, still optimistic, still wants to do a lot, still wonders where has the time gone, how can I make the most of my day, how can I continue to surround myself with you know wonderful, loving, amazing people, and and I I don't label myself as you know an actor or you know, purely

Identity Beyond Credits And Titles

Alfred Hsing 56:14

a martial artist. I mean, those are all things that are part of me, but I'm just someone that is excited for new things, excited to keep growing and and uh doing that alongside awesome people.

Greg Staffa 56:28

Perfect. Well said. Well, Alfred, thank you so much for coming on again. Train Dreams, check it out. It's getting a lot of Oscar buds and uh his other stuff. A lot of his stuff is on streaming, like Ready Player One and the Book of Boba Fett. So, Alfred, thank you so much for coming on. I look forward to seeing uh what you have up for next.

Alfred Hsing 56:47

Yeah, thank you. Thank you guys so much, and uh yeah, hope everyone can get a chance to check out Train Dreams um on Netflix. Um I I have a you know modest part in it, but I do feel like the film as a whole is a beautifully told story. Uh Joe Edgerton's acting is amazing. Director Clint Bentley's uh direction and and Adolfo, the DP's work is also all of it, the whole team is amazing. So, yes, check me out, but really, really check out the film. I think it's a film about life. So I hope people uh have a chance to see it.

Greg Staffa 57:17

Thank you.